Viewing 13 posts - 16 through 28 (of 28 total)
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  • #381162

    Anonymous

    Geneticaly speaking if we consider R1a1a Iranians dont fair so badly IMO. From prespective of R1a1a Iranians are more related to us than much of Western Europe but that is just one part of gene as i understand genetics (which i dont understand very well) so it isnt representive. :)

    #381163

    Anonymous

    From Europeans who have traveled to Iran I have heard only positive things. I like them because of their ancient civilisation and warrior spirit. Many Iranians also wanted to be like Europeans for many years. It is nonsense what is said about them being evil. My hope is the West do not attack them or that Europe will have to enter war against them.

    #381164

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    Geneticaly speaking if we consider R1a1a Iranians dont fair so badly IMO. From prespective of R1a1a Iranians are more related to us than much of Western Europe but that is just one part of gene as i understand genetics (which i dont understand very well) so it isnt representive. :)

    Well I don't know a lot about genetics aswell but you can't compare Iranians to Slavs only because of one haplogroup. A genotype is the product of many gene interactions, so having in common just one doesn't mean much.

    But no, I don't find anything in common with Iranians. Slavs are descendant of Scythians, and they had a lot to do with Persians, but Persian blood barely survived to this day. Better for us not to associate with them, our brothers are exclusively European folk who have preserved the "Aryan" blood.

    #381165

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    Slavic languages are part of Balto-Slavic subgroup of Indo-European languages, Iranian and Indo-Aryan of Indo-Iranian subgroup. I fail to se how we could have more similarities with Indo-Aryan lanuages, if we did not interact with them few thousand years, except with Gypsies.
    Concerning of genetics, we could conclude such things only if we have detailed genetic picture of entire Slavic and entire Indian population. (Which was not done yet as far as I know).
    So only cathegory of similarites left to us was cultural. Persian culture (both Islamic and pre-Islamic) is far more closer to us than Indian.

    Well the point is both have nothing in common with us today in the way we look.
    Ones are mostly Indian while others are mostly Semitic.

    Thought as i said at least with Indians we share proto-Indo-European roots as well as some haplogroups indicating of something similar thousands of years ago…Genetics testing have been done in india and mostly the High Castes have R1a blood and are much more Europid then the average indian we have in mind when we image them. But i don't understand the Iran fanboyism, they are neither Europid, neither have IE roots, but just Caucasoid. Thought if one is going to research as far as i have read on numerous forums in India their High Caste has mostly Indians with Europid features and light eyes, while in Iran among Isolated people (usually in mountains and such) one can find as well Europid light eyed examples. Maybe it indicates that both Indo-Europeans and Iranians(Aryans) where more Europid in it's ancient history and turned the way they are today due to influx of other pheotypes.

    Out of all Iranian speaking people only by our standards what we would call Europid are Nuristani Indo-Iranians in Afghanistan:
    image
    image
    image
    image

    Nuristani are an Indo-Iranian tribe in Afghanistan
    image
    image
    they are settled in the mountainous parts of the country and thus were preserved very well.

    The Nuristanis are a people whose ancestors practised what was apparently an ancient Indo-Iranian polytheistic Vedic religion until they were conquered and converted to Islam in the late 19th

    genetically the are most similar to Kalash people of Pakistan, again an isolated case of old Indo-Iranian people
    image
    [img width=700 height=525]http://www.galyat.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Galyat-Landscapes.jpg” />
    image
    image
    image

    and we have high cast Indians which show more europid features than the lower casts in Indian society:
    image

    #381166

    Anonymous

    Well, we share same roots with Iranian languages (not just Persian but also Kurdish, Ossetian). :) I had my biology clases long ago, so I chose to avoid genetics, there is lot of things to be considered there :) But I read about some Russian researches which showed certain degree of relations with Iranians (not sure Iranians as Persians or as whole group).
    On other level it is obvious that Indo-Iranians as whole do not look as rest Indo-Europeans, Gypsies are best example of it.

    #381167

    Anonymous
    Quote:

    Nuristanis are an ethnic group barely hovering over 300K and from what I have seen from personal experience "Persian/Afghani whiteness" hovers from individual to individual so I wouldn't label entire regions white.

    #381168

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    Nuristanis are an ethnic group barely hovering over 300K and from what I have seen from personal experience "Persian/Afghani whiteness" hovers from individual to individual so I wouldn't label entire regions white.

    I can't tell, never been there however on some forums some Iranians and such other people that are from the named countries claim it so i guess they would know better than me. But i didn't say the entire region is white, neither are the people in pictures completely white or europid, however many people in those regions seem to show such traits especially Indo-Iranian speaking ones.

    #381169

    Anonymous

    [table]
    [tr]
    [td][img height=300]http://realhistoryww.com/world_history/ancient/Misc/Common/India/Indian_Albinos/S_Mahesh_s.jpg” />[/td]
    [td][img height=300]http://realhistoryww.com/world_history/ancient/Misc/Common/India/Indian_Albinos/redneck_s.jpg” />[/td]
    [td][img height=300]http://realhistoryww.com/world_history/ancient/Misc/Common/India/Indian_Albinos/Kulshan_s.jpg” />[/td]
    [/tr]
    [/table]

    [table]
    [tr]
    [td][img height=290]http://www.galeriehilanehvonkories.de/assets/images/deffner/white-too-white/lightbox/large/S.Nagaraj.jpg” />[/td]
    [td][img height=290]http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/03/07/article-2111298-120DB025000005DC-167_634x424.jpg” />[/td]
    [/tr]
    [/table]

    All Indians, not even Aryans, but original Indians, Dravidians.

    #381170

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    I can't tell, never been there however on some forums some Iranians and such other people that are from the named countries claim it so i guess they would know better than me. But i didn't say the entire region is white, neither are the people in pictures completely white or europid, however many people in those regions seem to show such traits especially Indo-Iranian speaking ones.

    Zašto si tako defanzivan brate? ;D

    #381171

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    Really? How would you explain that while among Indians we have the highest genes that cluster with Slavs and we both relate by Indo-European language, while with Iranians we share neither genes neither language?

    So out of all European ethnic groups, Slavs share the highest gene cluster with Indians? Or high caste Indians share more with all Europeans than Iranians do? (Just trying to clarify)

    #381172

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    So out of all European ethnic groups, Slavs share the highest gene cluster with Indians? Or high caste Indians share more with all Europeans than Iranians do? (Just trying to clarify)

    To better rephrase it High Caste Indians show more Europid traits both genetically and in phenotype most likely because they preserved the original phenotype of Indo-Iranian Aryans which looked Europid, probably because of breeding selection of breeding only with other high caste Indo-Iranians. Thought even the high-caste Indians today are highly mixed but they have higer percentages of light eyes or more europid skull shape than the lower castes.

    As for Slavs they share the highest gene cluster with Scandinavians (1st place Norway, 2nd Iceland, while in Sweden it is very low thought).

    #381173

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    So out of all European ethnic groups, Slavs share the highest gene cluster with Indians? Or high caste Indians share more with all Europeans than Iranians do? (Just trying to clarify)

    Well I dont know what to say. First there are two completely different maps about R1a1, (different concerning India it is)


    [table][tr][td]
    [/td][/tr][/table]
    [table][tr][td][img height=320 width=400]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/75/Distribution_Haplogroup_R1a_Y-DNA.svg” />[/td]
    [td][img height=320 width=400]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/94/R1a1a_distribution.png” />[/td]
    [/tr]
    [/table]

    Other than that, Brahmins (members of highest Indian do not look European)


    [table][tr][td]
    [/td][/tr][/table]
    [table][tr][td][img height=160]http://http://www.indianetzone.com/photos_gallery/42/south-indian-brahmins.jpg” />[/td]
    [td][img height=160]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d7/Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-61849-0001%2C_Indien%2C_Otto_Grotewohl_bei_Ministerpr%C3%A4sident_Nehru_cropped.jpg” />[/td]
    [td][img height=160]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/27/Bhagwan_Gopinath.jpg” />[/td]
    [td][img height=160]http://www.hindustantimes.com/Images/2010/5/d84c867b-d101-4a08-8e29-d32deeb8e079HiRes.JPG” />[/td]
    [td][img height=160]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_pCG_c3Rq788/S8srEXiM4BI/AAAAAAAAHPc/x8GABBnnhA4/s1600/Calcutta+1945+22.jpg” />[/td]
    [td][img height=160]http://filipspagnoli.files.wordpress.com/2009/11/brahmin.jpg” />[/td]
    [td][img height=160]http://photos.travelblog.org/Photos/73812/324156/f/2850878-Brahmin-priest-0.jpg” />[/td]
    [/tr]
    [/table]

    People with more European traits are not Brahmins or Kshatriya, but rather small isolated groups in mountains of Pakistan, Afganistan and Kashmir.

    There is linguistic and genetic relation (altough we are not sure about proportions of genetic link).

    #381174

    Anonymous

    Hello – nice to find your forum.

    There is an extremely large amount of misinformation in this thread.

    The reality is that Iranians are no less true to their origins (Median, Persian, Parthian, and importantly beyond the borders of Iran, Ossetian – all original IE speaking Aryan tribes) than any Slavic country is to theirs. In fact, I would argue, that depending on the country, it's more difficult to show origins due to large migratory patterns in the Balkans.

    It is extremely misguided for one to look at how similar one looks to a Northern European as an indication of whether or not or "how" Aryan their ancestors were or how much they are today. Long before anyone in Central or Western Europe assigned the notion that the word "Aryan" had any association with light eyes or light hair, there was a country and empire who's name meant (and still means today) "Land of the Aryans"  – Iran, also known as Aryana in antiquity.

    What the pictures you are displaying about light haired and light eyed people in Afghanistan indicates, is that there are light haired and light eyed people there. That's it. Because they look more "Nordic" to you, does not infer they are more "white" – which by the way, is not a racial term, neither is "European." These are all constructs and fake divisions of the Caucasian and IE-speaking peoples of the world. These are not indicators of anything other than prevalence of phenotypes.
    A dark haired, dark eyed Iranian is no less different from her ancestors than a dark haired dark eyed Romanian is regarding her ancestors.

    Using common sense alone can lead to the relief paintings and sculptures of Iranians from millenia BC that look entirely like what an Iranian looks like today.

    The genetic evidence does not support the wild theories that Iranians are mixed with their neighbors historically [extremely physically distant neighbors – I would remind you that Iran is half the size of the United States].

    Having said that, most Iranians who have interest in other Slavic speaking countries, to do see them as brothers, particularly Bulgaria(who many including myself consider more Bulgar than Slav), Ukraine and Croatia, all with which we share interesting links to our pagan heritage.

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