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  • #344648

    Anonymous

    http://faq.macedonia.org/history/macedonian.voice.html

    Let Us Set Out Towards the Slavic Victory, published in the tenth issue of the periodical Macedonian Voice (August 13, 1914):

    "Macedonians! For five whole centuries we bore the Turkish slavery imposed upon us. For five whole centuries we unceasingly surrendered our lives and submitted ourselves to great sacrifices so that in the end we could gain our freedom. Unique, undivided and independent. That is what Macedonia was and that is what our banner, before which we swore to either win or die, now bears as its symbol. And all our Slavic brothers who unhypocritically wished and still wish to help us in our fight for freedom received and continue to receive the heartfelt acknowledgement and gratitude of the Macedonian people.

    Not so very long ago, the liberation of Macedonia was declared by the manifestoes of the Bulgarian and Serbian kings; two western Slavic peoples had espoused our cause. Viewing the situation from their angle, in particular with regard to the fact that they themselves had been aided in their liberation wars by Russia, their engagement with the Macedonian problem is regarded by many, among which number we count ourselves, as a payment of the brotherly debt and as a natural obligation to continue Russia�s liberation effort on the Balkans. Finally, in gratitude for the noble Russian blood which was shed for them they are expected to repay in kind for the liberation of the only remaining Slavic land still in the hands of the Turks � Macedonia.

    However, all those who believed this to be so were deceived. The Second Balkan War, which with its corpses covered and with its flames embraced the Macedonian fields, and which ended with the declaration of peace in Bucharest and the division of our fatherland into three parts, revealed the true reason why the Balkan allies started the war against the allies. There was nothing brotherly about their involvement. And so before us Macedonians there appeared once more, in all its stark~ reality, the necessity to fight for our ideals to the very end so that we can win not only our independence and freedom, but our intactness, the restoration of a destroyed entity. This battle was up until this moment our holy, immediate task, the reason for our existence as an independent Slavic race, which appeared on the Balkan Peninsula earlier than any other and which carried its national self-awareness throughout the centuries of oppressive slavery.

    And now, coming as a complete surprise to a considerable number of people, we find ourselves face to face with the long awaited, and according to its scope, impressive war between all of Slavicism and the aggressor, Germanism.

    A European war such as has never before been noted in the chronicles of world history is now unfolding. The more developed countries such as France, England and Belgium, later joined by other countries among which was Italy, which had declared its determined decision to refrain from becoming an ally to the Germans, appear as opponents of the tyranny imposed upon Europe by Austrian and German militarism.

    And we, Macedonians, must comprehend the crucial meaning of this present historical moment and agree that now before us, the oldest Slavic race, from whose womb were born the first Slav teachers SS. Cyril and Methodius and the initial beginnings of our culture, stands the task of starting out towards the ultimate goal which is shared by all of Slavism and towards which we must unswervingly Strive, joining with the others in the great war against the teutonic enemy, justifying the expectations of a great Russia and believing in the fact that Slavism will stand up to the severe test in harmonious comradeship with her.

    Let us remind ourselves, Macedonians, that our fathers and grandfathers have always been fighters, not only for the Macedonian cause but also for the general Slavic cause."

    #401849

    Anonymous

    Macedonian Voice was entirely funded by Serbs. Nice try. Also it's funny to see your article cite Krste Misirkov. The guy who was funded by Novakovic but recanted his views in his book. Come on, if you're going to root for Macedonism… don't cite sources of guys who have already recanted their pro-Macedonist views. ;)

    #401850

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    Macedonian Voice was entirely funded by Serbs. Nice try. Also it's funny to see your article cite Krste Misirkov. The guy who was funded by Novakovic but recanted his views in his book. Come on, if you're going to root for Macedonism… don't cite sources of guys who have already recanted their pro-Macedonist views. ;)

    Piss-weak response Dusan. You can do better than that. Funded by Serbs? What do you have against Serbs? Why don't you mention the role of the Russians here?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macedonian_Scientific_and_Literary_Society

    #401851

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    Piss-weak response Dusan. You can do better than that. Funded by Serbs? What do you have against Serbs? Why don't you mention the role of the Russians here?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macedonian_Scientific_and_Literary_Society

    Nooooo! Macedonian Voice was established by the Association of Serbo-Macedonians.

    The Association of Serbo-Macedonians was a Serbophile organization, founded in 1886 in Istanbul by a young Macedonians, members of a secret Macedonian committee in Sofia. After being pursued there, four members of the Committee founded that year in Sofia: Temko Popov, Naum Evrov, Kosta Grupchev and Vasil Karayovov, went to Belgrade. In Serbia they wanted to secure support for their proposed actions in Macedonia. Their plans included the restoration of the Archbishopric of Ohrid, publication of a newspaper called “Macedonian Voice”, opening schools where teachers used the Macedonian dialect, debulgarization of the Macedonian Slavs etc. At that time, the geopolitics of the Serbs played the significant role in the Macedonian ethnogenosis by promoting a separate Macedonian consciousness at the expense of the Bulgarian idea. They met here with the Serbian politician Stojan Novaković, who promised them support. Novaković proposed to employ the macedonistic ideas to counteract the Bulgarian influence in Macedonia, and in this way promoting Serbian interests in the region.

    #401852

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    Nooooo! Macedonian Voice was established by the Association of Serbo-Macedonians.

    The Association of Serbo-Macedonians was a Serbophile organization, founded in 1886 in Istanbul by a young Macedonians, members of a secret Macedonian committee in Sofia. After being pursued there, four members of the Committee founded that year in Sofia: Temko Popov, Naum Evrov, Kosta Grupchev and Vasil Karayovov, went to Belgrade. In Serbia they wanted to secure support for their proposed actions in Macedonia. Their plans included the restoration of the Archbishopric of Ohrid, publication of a newspaper called “Macedonian Voice”, opening schools where teachers used the Macedonian dialect, debulgarization of the Macedonian Slavs etc. At that time, the geopolitics of the Serbs played the significant role in the Macedonian ethnogenosis by promoting a separate Macedonian consciousness at the expense of the Bulgarian idea. They met here with the Serbian politician Stojan Novaković, who promised them support. Novaković proposed to employ the macedonistic ideas to counteract the Bulgarian influence in Macedonia, and in this way promoting Serbian interests in the region.

    Georgi Pulevski's dictionary in the Macedonian language in 1875 – 11 years before the formation of the association you mention above:

    image

    1n 1875, he published a book called Dictionary of Three Languages (Rečnik od tri jezika, Речник од три језика). It was a conversational phrasebook composed in "question-and-answer" style in three parallel columns, in Macedonian Slavic, Albanian and Turkish, all three spelled in Cyrillic. Pulevski chose to write in the local Macedonian Slavic rather than the Bulgarian standard based on eastern Tarnovo dialects. His language was an attempt at creating a supra-dialectal Macedonian norm, but with a bias towards his own native local Galičnik dialect [1] The text of the Rečnik contains programmatic statements where Pulevski argues for an independent Macedonian nation and language.[1]

    What do we call a nation? – People who are of the same origin and who speak the same words and who live and make friends of each other, who have the same customs and songs and entertainment are what we call a nation, and the place where that people lives is called the people's country. Thus the Macedonians also are a nation and the place which is theirs is called Macedonia.

    #401853

    Anonymous

    Gee, why not you bring up George's last work? Again you leave out things that are inconvenient to your version of history.

    In his last work: “Jazitshnica, soderzsayushtaja starobolgarski ezik, uredena em izpravlena da se uchat bolgarski i makedonski sinove i kerki"; ('Grammar, containing Old Bulgarian language, arranged and corrected to be taught to Bulgarian and Macedonian sons and daughters'), he considered the Macedonian dialects to be old Bulgarian and the differences between the two purely geographical.

    #401854

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    Gee, why not you bring up George's last work? Again you leave out things that are inconvenient to your version of history.

    In his last work: “Jazitshnica, soderzsayushtaja starobolgarski ezik, uredena em izpravlena da se uchat bolgarski i makedonski sinove i kerki"; ('Grammar, containing Old Bulgarian language, arranged and corrected to be taught to Bulgarian and Macedonian sons and daughters'), he considered the Macedonian dialects to be old Bulgarian and the differences between the two purely geographical.

    Why would he do such things though?

    #401855

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    Why would he do such things though?

    He had his beginnings in an isolated village near Mavrovo. Of course he was barely educated and this fact was repeatedly confirmed by just reading his works which were poorly done. He obviously later realized his Bulgarian roots and he did this by freely moving to Bulgaria and choosing Sofiya as the place to die. George Pulevski is a Bulgarian patriot.

    #401856

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    He had his beginnings in an isolated village near Mavrovo. Of course he was barely educated and this fact was repeatedly confirmed by just reading his works which were poorly done. He obviously later realized his Bulgarian roots and he did this by freely moving to Bulgaria and choosing Sofiya as the place to die. George Pulevski is a Bulgarian patriot.

    But why support Macedonism, and why so early on?

    #401857

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    But why support Macedonism, and why so early on?

    I wouldn't call it Macedonism per se. George was still learning about himself. He was from an isolated village with little education. His ethnic identification took on a regional meaning. It is definitely enlightening to know he fought in the Bulgarian army and later moved to Sofiya to retire. He was profoundly Bulgarian in his later life when he wrote his notations on the differences between Macedonians and Bulgarians being merely geographical. It's not really much of a question whether George felt Bulgarian or not. The answer is obvious.

    #401858

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    I wouldn't call it Macedonism per se. George was still learning about himself. He was from an isolated village with little education. His ethnic identification took on a regional meaning. It is definitely enlightening to know he fought in the Bulgarian army and later moved to Sofiya to retire. He was profoundly Bulgarian in his later life when he wrote his notations on the differences between Macedonians and Bulgarians being merely geographical. It's not really much of a question whether George felt Bulgarian or not. The answer is obvious.

    OK so you're speculating here. Do you think it's more conceivable that he was a Macedonian that was influenced by Bulgarian propaganda? Since Macedonia did not exist as a state, many Macedonians who desired an education had to go to either Sofia or Belgrade, or even to Russia. Naturally they were influenced by the education they received and the society in which they lived in.

    #401859

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    OK so you're speculating here. Do you think it's more conceivable that he was a Macedonian that was influenced by Bulgarian propaganda? Since Macedonia did not exist as a state, many Macedonians who desired an education had to go to either Sofia or Belgrade, or even to Russia. Naturally they were influenced by the education they received and the society in which they lived in.

    The Exarchate's borders went on to extend over present-day northern Bulgaria (Moesia), Thrace without the Vilayet of Adrianople, as well as over north-eastern Macedonia. After the Christian population of the bishoprics of Skopje and Ohrid voted in 1874 overwhelmingly in favour of joining the Exarchate (Skopje by 91%, Ohrid by 97%)

    The political concept of a Macedonian people never existed until the recent common era. That is a historical fact. Ohrid was a Bulgarian educational centre for centuries. That is a historical fact. Tsar Samuil was a Bulgarian emperor. That is a historical fact. Bulgarian Macedonians voted to join the Bulgarian Exarchate by a overwhelming margin, that is a historical fact. Stop trying to distory history. It just ain't gonna work.

    #401860

    Anonymous

    This is a map of the Exarchate. Are you suggesting all these people were/are Bulgarian?

    image

    #401861

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    This is a map of the Exarchate. Are you suggesting all these people were/are Bulgarian?

    Of course he is. What did you expect from him?  ;D
    Exarchist leaders were asking for 3 eparchies in Bosnia and Hercegovina to be included. It was to much even for Ottomans.

    #401862

    Anonymous

    Instead of veering off-topic with your Pulevski obsession (has Macedonism now come down to a single, barely-literate villager?) Let's get back to the original topic of discussion. The Macedonian Voice.  Did you really believe it was written by ethnic Macedonians?  It's quite obvious the rag was just another piece of propaganda created by political Serbs in furthering their fantasy that we are non-Slavic evil Tatars. It's the why the MV kept going Slav this and Slav that. Or are your eyes still closed to Novakovism?

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