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  • #343784

    Anonymous

    [size=14pt]Visit of Russian Orthodox Church head to Poland
    promises improvement of Polish-Russian relations
    [/size]

    The official visit by the head of the Russian Orthodox Church, Patriarch Kirill of Moscow and
    All Russia to the largely Catholic Poland that began on Thursday raises hopes for a opening
    a new chapter in the strained Polish-Russian relations.

    “I hope that my Polish visit will be a modest contribution to improving relations between Poland
    and the countries where the Russian Orthodox Church is present”, Patriarch Kirill said during a
    welcome ceremony at Warsaw's airport, adding that this was the first ever visit paid by the
    Patriarch of Moscow to Poland.

    Today, Kyrill I and the head of the Conference of the Polish Episcopate Jozef Michalik will sign a
    historic address to both nations seeking reconciliation between the historic foes and mutual
    forgiveness of past harms, injustice and all evil done by them.

    “A road to reconciliation is a dialog which refers to such fundamental values as freedom, responsibility,
    love for human being and forgiveness,” Polish President Bronislaw Komorowski said yesterday during
    meeting with the Patriarch.

    President Komorowski expressed his satisfaction with the fact that the joint message on behalf of
    both Churches will be signed.

    “This address opens a new chapter in the relations between the two Churches and I hope that this
    act will also become an important step on a road to reconciliation and intensive dialog based on
    truth, trust good will and understanding between the two nations.” Komorowski said.

    The patriarch said he was convinced common Christian roots would help the two nations overcome “misunderstandings”.

    “It’s wonderful that Christian culture dominates in both Poland and Russia. This means we have
    a common foundation for the resolution of questions which arose in the past,” he said.

    Poles and Russians have a long and often painful history stained by four centuries of conflict. There
    are still some Poles who remember the execution of over 22,000 Polish citizens – largely army officers,
    by Soviet secret police in 1940 in the Katyn forest.

    More than four decades of Soviet communist rule after WWII have also damaged the relations between
    the two nations. These relations have worsened even more since the 2010 airplane crash in Russia that
    killed Polish President Lech Kaczynski and 95 other officials as Poles have had a sense that the Russians
    were not fully cooperative in investigating the crash.

    Source

    #391646

    Anonymous

    Strange article. What Russian Church have with Communist crimes? Russian Church and people were biggest victims of bolshevism.
    Anyway, I support anything which will help reconciliation between Poles and Russians.

    #391647

    Anonymous

    I do agree, it is strange article. It clearly shows a few things clearly wrong with Slavic relations.

    Number one:
    The patriarch said he was convinced common Christian roots would help the two nations overcome “misunderstandings”.

    WRONG. Common Slavic roots should help the two nations overcome their differences more than anything.

    Number two:
    Well, we can just see how much the Christian religion has to say in Slavic affairs, while originally Slavic beliefs have little to know say in the mainstream.

    Number three:
    The article also shows how Christian identity (Catholic in Poland, Eastern Orthodox in Russia) is intertwined with nationalism. A certain previous member for this forum who shall remain nameless was bloody intent on making that division as wide and deep and impassable as possible. To this day, Polish nationalists who are often ultra-Catholic, swear that Communists only committed crimes in Poland and Catholic Poland is innocent. Vice Versa in Russia and Ukraine too.

    I too support reconciliation, but it should be done along the most effective lines and reaffirming the deepest relations that Slavs have. By now Christianity is a part of it, but so are a few other key things.

    #391648

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    WRONG. Common Slavic roots should help the two nations overcome their differences more than anything.

    Patriarch is speaking from his perspective of Christian bishop. He did not tried neglect common Slavic heritage, but it is natural to hear such thing from Christian bishop who is meeting another Christian bishop. And Russian and Polish cultures were built on both Christian and Slavic heritage.

    Quote:
    Number two:
    Well, we can just see how much the Christian religion has to say in Slavic affairs, while originally Slavic beliefs have little to know say in the mainstream.

    I don't wish to tart another discussion about Chrisitanity and Paganism but:
    How much Slavs practise original Slavic beliefs? Exactly none. Even neopaganism is marginal religion at best in both Russia and Poland, while Orthodox and Roman Catholicism are largest religions in Russia and Polad respectively, and constitute large part in national identities of Russians and Poles.

    Quote:
    Number three:
    The article also shows how Christian identity (Catholic in Poland, Eastern Orthodox in Russia) is intertwined with nationalism. A certain previous member for this forum who shall remain nameless was bloody intent on making that division as wide and deep and impassable as possible. To this day, Polish nationalists who are often ultra-Catholic, swear that Communists only committed crimes in Poland and Catholic Poland is innocent. Vice Versa in Russia and Ukraine too.

    It is truth that Russian nationalists are mostly zelous Orthodox Christians, but Russian rodnovers are equally nationalistc and offten chauvinistic.

    #391649

    Anonymous

    Well I don't know how this "Patriarch" is connected with Russians, but surely he has no connection with Orthodoxy. I dislike to comment such news related with Christianity because my comments would be considered as an attack against faith, but this's an exception. This "Patriarch" is a bag of shit, the right hand, foot and d*** of government. He is a shame of Orthodoxy, every his speech only discredits the Church.

    I don't want to support pagans in this thread, but I have to admit that after the repressions against Russian Orthodox Church in the 1920-1930s, the ROC became the one of communist instruments. This "Patriarch" isn't an exception:

    [IMG]http://i48.tinypic.com/2z5m55h.jpg” />

    #391650

    Anonymous

    russian orthodox church is whore of state, its no secret that caesaropapism is still alive and well in russia.

    #391651

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    russian orthodox church is whore of state,

    Barov, I suppose you know that Church is not just clerics but people as well. So you called tens of millions of Russians prostitute of state. Isn't that hatred speech and pointless provocation? Or from liberal mouth dirty words are not offensive? Not to mention that that peace of political balbering is off-topic here, and shows why Slavs need reconciliation on religious basis (in this case between Christians and followers of religion of Liberalism).

    Last time I checked it was forbidden to offend Slavic people.

    Or all of this is just connected with three promiscous women, who love to have orgies in museums, with bad taste in music and clothing, rotting in Russian jail?

    Quote:
    its no secret that caesaropapism is still alive and well in russia.

    Meh, still better than papocesarism in some other Churches.
    PS
    Cesaropapism is official thing in England, Sweden, Norway, Dannmeark and other liberal paradises.

    #391652

    Anonymous

    Yeah, Zrkadlo, watch your liberal speech and write names of countries with the capital letter.

    #391653

    Anonymous

    some people use "nazi" as swear word, you use "liberal". concerning ROC, scroll up and read what posters above me wrote. i wrote the same using a synonym for prostitute, hmm ok i am sorry. whats liberal about that?

    dalibor, pointing at others doesnt mean ROC is better. I can tell you that catholic church in slovakia is in similar situation, but not so bad.
    we dont have people with icons of robert fico (yet)

    #391654

    Anonymous
    Quote:
    some people use "nazi" as swear word, you use "liberal". concerning ROC, scroll up and read what posters above me wrote. i wrote the same using a synonym for prostitute, hmm ok i am sorry. whats liberal about that?

    As I said, you should be able to separate majority of Priests and people from Kiril. And I sincerly doubt you and even Sibiryak know all accusations about Kiril. I know good deal of them, and because I do not live in Russia and do not have good picture about situation there I do not have mind, I am not atatcking him, but do not defnding him.

    Quote:
    dalibor, pointing at others doesnt mean ROC is better. I can tell you that catholic church in slovakia is in similar situation, but not so bad.

    Measuring who is more bad, is pointless. I did not mention RCC at all.

    Quote:
    we dont have people with icons of robert fico (yet)

    Nor the Russian Orthodox Church have icons of Putin. If you refer on pictures from this forum, you could see it is sect. You should know that there is no ordination of women in Orthodoxy.

    #391655

    Anonymous

    Poster above you wrote about repressions against Russian Orthodox Church as priests and believers together, and ROC (English language analogue of Russian "РПЦ") as the organization of church officials in Moscow.

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